New Zealanders know all too well the pain Australian rugby fans are enduring right now.
It was the last time the Rugby World Cup was held in France that the All Blacks were bundled out by the hosts in the quarter-finals.
From that all-time low in 2007 came a warts-and-all review, totalling 47 pages, that found holes in the team's preparation, lack of quality game time leading into the tournament, and a poorly executed conditioning program.
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In the four years that followed, Graham Henry and New Zealand Rugby turned the side into an unbeatable machine that resulted in back-to-back Webb Ellis Cup wins in 2011, at home, and 2015 in England.
Now, the Wallabies find themselves in a similar spot – at rock bottom and with a chance to redeem themselves in four years time on home soil.
Languishing 10th in the world rankings and out of the tournament before making it to the quarter-finals, reform is needed and is being urged from all corners.
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"We are sharing a bit of the hurt with you now because it's a step too far – far too far for us," said All Blacks great Jeff Wilson on Stan Sport's Rugby Heaven.
"They're one of our greatest rivals. We know how the Bledisloe Cup was when we played. We wanted it to get back to that. It hasn't managed to find a way back across the Tasman, which means it's lost a little bit of that (lustre), but when I look at the group and when I look at the talent that's there… is the talent there maybe just not quite ready?"
It's that question that has raised a new theory as to why Australian rugby has suffered.
It's not exclusive to Australia either, as All Blacks icon Andrew Mehrtens explained.
"I think formulaic rugby works a lot better in junior rugby. You look at teams that are under-13, under-14 that have spent four, five, or six years together. That has a huge advantage," he said.
"Formulaic rugby, which I think Aussie rugby players are learning in the pathway a little too much at schools rugby and at junior rugby level, learning too much structured stuff, they're losing the ability, I think, early – before they get to the senior levels – to make good decisions and to use good skills.
"New Zealand coaches who have experienced Super Rugby say that. They're getting players that they're having to work on basic skills that they don't believe they should have to work on, basic decision making. There is a youth development program that needs to be put into place."
Since South Africa won the 2019 Rugby World Cup, there has been a global shift that has made northern hemisphere teams the powerhouses.
South Africa has remained a powerhouse in its own right, however, and has enjoyed success since leaving Super Rugby to join the United Rugby Championship with Ireland, Scotland, Italy, and Wales.
It begs the question whether Australia and New Zealand have been left behind. The World Rankings are the best evidence of that, with both teams reaching their worst standing since the system was introduced in 2003.
Australia and New Zealand both recorded record-first losses in 2022. The Wallabies were beaten by Italy for the first time while the All Blacks suffered their first loss to Argentina at home as well as back-to-back defeats to Ireland.
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Wilson said the issues Australia is enduring in its pathways aren't exclusive to them.
"You talk about that formulaic rugby or the structured rugby, we're starting to experience that in New Zealand now," said Wilson
"It's coming through our high schools and we're starting to see some of our players suffer from the same things.
"Ultimately, let's be honest, the game at the highest level and the laws and the way the game is played, I'm not sure it suits the Australian skill set and it doesn't suit our skill set as well.
"It's hard to score tries. We're seeing that in the game. When you've got that ability to play and you can't do it, but then you can't go to your set piece, you can't go to your line-out drive — we've seen Fiji of all countries completely change the way they play."
For ex-Wallabies veteran Tim Horan, there's a tug-of-war at play too.
With some players pinched for NRL or AFL programs, he believes there also need to be incentives for young guns to stick with rugby union.
"We need to tighten that. Yes, it's going to cost. We need a big benefactor to help provide some funds to keep control of those kids in grade 11 and 12 for the first couple of years after school. Then our player base will get broadened," said Horan.
"I walked around the other day and saw the All Blacks players having dinner over here in one of the alleyways. Richie Mo'unga was there, I actually had a quick chat to him and he's disappointed about what's happening," he added.
"I said, 'Mate, how do you help?' They're keen to help. If I'm Phil Waugh (Rugby Australia CEO), I'm going to New Zealand before Christmas, I'm going over there, I'm sitting down with New Zealand Rugby – 'How can you guys help us?'
"We don't know all the answers. How can we help each other to be stronger? I said to Richie Mo'unga, the way you can help us is maybe just give us the Bledisloe every three years. It's tough and we need partners to help us go forward."
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